Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

You might want to have it independently surveyed before you take delivery...just to be safe.

Boats Back!
 

The boat arrived back in Houston today just before noon.

Three of the many cracks (one under the console and the two on each side of cockpit) they were supposed to repair were not touched and the transom has cracked again on the starboard side....well it's not just a crack...it opens when you push down on the starboard engine.

Hows that for a top notch repair job?

Re: Boats Back!
 

Boy I sorry to hear that. I was hopping to read I good ending to a nightmarish story. Sounds like a sequel to one man’s boating horror story is just beginning.
FellowShip [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Re: Boats Back!
 

Naturally you now have to question every repair that was made to that hull [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

The boat hasn’t even seen water ???
So it sounds like what you are saying is that the transom got fixed ... Boat got shipped back to you ... the stress of the motors during shipping caused the transom repair to reopen...Cant wait to hear what they say about this one !!! [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: Boats Back!
 

Capt C.

I don't know many lawyers, but I think it is way past time to become friends with a very good one(a good Philadelphia lawyer...).

[img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]

Re: Boats Back!
 

Yes....just the trip to Houston caused the cack to open back up.

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

I am very sorry to hear that, I have been watching your post since the start and this has to be the worst thing that could of happened. So now the question is... whats next?

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

Hey capt c sorry to here about the dillema. But like everyone else has been telling you it might be time for some legal action. Do your self a favor have your lawyer or a lawyer draft a letter to Tracker and I would be willing to bet you'll be riding in your new boat by the end of the week. A big company will usually dick around the customer as long as it takes until they go away or until they show up at there door with a lawyer. So far every one your dealing with sounds nice but the nicer they are the easier it is to stall. well good luck
hope to hear tracker makes good on this one. [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

Capt. C,

How Farging stupid can tracker be? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img] I am sure as heck they know forums like this one, thehulltruth, continuouswave and many many others exist. Don't they care one bit. What, did they just have some halfa$$ed glassman do the cheepest job available? DID THEY EVEN SPEND 20 MANHOURS ON YOUR FIX???? I'M GUESSING THE SAME TEAM THAT BUILT YOUR BOAT FIXED IT!!!! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] DID THEY EVEN WATER TEST IT? Was there a repair bill? They must know that by doing such a poor job you would either just give up and sell the boat or hire a lawyer. At this point you have not, and that is good for them. I think there are a few members on this board kind of wondering why you havn't persued the legal path right from the get go....


Please post some pix. I will personally write SeaCraft myself and express my disappointment in how they handled this. I'll also post links to this site elsewhere. I cannot tell you how disappointed I am in their "fix."
The new corporate name should be SEACRAP! [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/mad.gif[/img]
Their tag line "The legend dies...." [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

Guys,

I was told by a maritime Lawyer I had to let them try to repair the boat...well they tried...kinda. If you are interested in e-mailing someone you need to direct your e-mails to Tracker Marine. To my knowledge SeaCraft doesn't even know I have a problem. All of the SeaCraft e-mails go though Tracker. Here is a list of the things I have found on the boat since it returned.

This list I sent this morning to some of the upper brass at Tracker.

1. After I had the T-Top (12-27-03) repaired I tightened all the screws that go into the floor. I found there is a plate mounted in the floor that the screws are threaded into. Most of the screws were stripped so I put 1/4X20 nylon locking nuts on all but two of the screws, I couldn’t reach the last two. During the trip to Tennessee for some reason they removed most of the nut on the starboard front post and those of course are all loose.

2. Both rear rub rail on have been bent and no longer fit in the corners properly any longer. There is also light coming though the rub rail area in the starboard rear corner. You can also see how thin the fiberglass is in the spot where they did some patch work. And finally the end of the rub rail on the port side where it ends at the splash well never had a screw put in it to hold it in place.


3. The front bilge area that they (mystery repair shop in Tennessee) said that there had no problem draining has a couple inches water in it to the point it has filled the storage area inside the center console with 1/4” of water.

4. I was told by both Tracker and Bass Pro Shop that the boat would be loaded onto a trailer and transported to Tennessee, but after it had left I was told they hauled my boat on my trailer. Which in its self is not a big deal, but the boat sat at Bass Pro Shop and the mystery shop in Tennessee that two tires lost enough air pressure to cause significant tire wear on the front left tire and right rear tire.

5. The splash well pulled free from the transom and no steps were taken to bond it back to the transom.. I am sure the factory had intended this bonded area to help shore up the top of the transom.

6. The obvious crack in the bulkhead at the rear of the fuel tanks still is not repaired. I was given an explanation from Tracker Marine why it wasn’t repaired, but it was so much double talk I honestly don’t recall what I was told. I didn’t plan to contest the explanation until after I seen what had been done. I personally can’t find any repair that will have shored up the deck.


7. Neither corner of the cockpit area where repaired and the port side now has a second crack that developed during it’s time in Tennessee.

I have photos of all of the above item, but I don't remember what the secret word is to access the Boat Zone.

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

Capt-

Anything new happening with this?

AR.

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

I am still waiting for their offical response.

I am pretty sure I know what is wrong with the boat now, but I want to wait until I talk to them (Tracker) before I post what I have recently found.

I will say it's not good.

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

I would be so pissed that I would buy a booth at the next boat show and show off your "new" SeaCraft. Congratulation on your patience. Let me know what I can do to help. I love to write letters and emails.

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

Hey Four Boat Theory, you have not properly licenced the "Four Boat Theory" name/trademark from Finster Inc.
Please siece all "Four Boat Theory" activity at once or I shale be force to call my attorney or even worse I will tell your wife. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

Anything going on? It's about a month now.....FYI On Thehulltruth.com there's been quite alot of talk about poor quality with hydrasports and angler lately.

C'mon, seacraft----man up here!

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

I felt pretty good last week when I found out one of Tracker Marine's managment level guys was flying in to view the boat personally. We went over all the problems on 6-18-04 and he told me he was going to meet with his boss the next day. He told me he might call Friday, but I told him I would be fishing for the weekend. So he said he would call Monday the 21st. It's now Thursday and all I have received was a one sentence e-mail that said nothing.

I had the warm and fuzzy feeling up till Tuesday afternoon because NO ONE who has seen the boat in person has not said they hull needs to be replaced! That warm and fuzzy has been replaced by a cold and muddy feeling.

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

Stay on top of these guys. Give them a call.

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

Any updates????

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

I had the boat surveyed after Tracker Marine came down and declaired the boat "seaworthy" in it's present condition, which includes; (repaired/patched up cracked again transom), nothing done about the cracked bulkhead, center console completely loose from hull.......the under deck around the console has been pretty much distroyed-around 15 structural type cracks.

The surveyor stated the boat is "unsafe" and "unsound" and "the subject vessel should not be operated underway until all structural repaires are made."

I've just received the estimate for the repairs per the survey and I'm putting it all in the mail today. We'll see....but I don't have my hopes up. [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

What does your lawyer say?

I don't see why Tracker is not being a stand up company in supporting their products on what all indications point to a shoddy built boat. They are trying to compete in a marketplace where names such as Contender, Regulator, and Pursuit have sadly passed them by. On the other hand, if they wish to be included in negative discussion with the likes of Bayliner and Angler and SeaFox, they are well on their way to achieving that distinction. Personally, and not trying to be a "classic" snob here, I more and more appreciate the distinction between a "Classic Seacraft" and the Tracker marketing plan of the "Classic" designation in the current crop of new Seacrafts.

Hey guys at Tracker - thanks for making my 79 more valuable every day...

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

good move on the survey...3rd party input in your favor can't hurt if you end up going to court...

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

I guess I should have listened to you guys a long time ago and had the survey done in the beginning. I felt everything was obvious that I didn't need to spend the money. LESSON LEARNED! Although I think doing it the way I have allowed me to find all the problems the boat has. I am not sure a surveyor would have caught them all. You can’t remove a panel inside/under the console and not find a new crack. I have found several since the survey that the surveyor didn’t see/find. I do think he had seen enough to know that the boat was “unsafe” and “unsound” so that maybe why he stopped looking.

According to Texas law I have protection under the Texas Deceptive Trade Act (TDTA). The fact that I have been told by numerous employee’s of Tracker Marine/Bass Pro Shop, that I have copies of e-mails to me stating I have warranty and because Tracker Marine has stated in e-mails to other people that state that they have honored the transfer of my warranty I have as good a case as anyone could have against them under the TDTA. I just don’t want a long drawn out court battle unless they insist on pushing me to it. The law also has provisions that make them pay up in a timely manner as well. I am entitled to claim a 6 digit figure against them just for the boat if this goes to court, so they stand a huge chance to loose big.

At this point I still have not found another 25’ SeaCraft with this many problems, so I feel this is an isolated case. Why Tracker Marine won’t admit this boat has serious issues is beyond me. All I have ever asked for is to have what I bought...A top tier offshore boat. I have really liked the boat. I have yet to find a 25’ boat I like better and I have looked at the 23T Contender (25’ LOA). It’s a damn fine boat...if it’s built right.

I sent everything to them yesterday, so I should know in about a week if I’m going fishing or going to court.

Tracker has a BIG problem!
 

Capt.,

I'm sorry they are putting you through this. But, please persist in your action as it will surely produce the correct results. You have been honorable in your handling of this by not going to the press and/or slamming them on the forums. However, regardless of the outcome of your settlement attempt, if this gets heavily publicised, it will cost thems hundreds of thousands in future lost sales.

As a business owner, we have insurance for all the bad stuff that can happen. We sell used Food Machinery without warantee. We do, however, have a policy to keep us out of this kind of "trouble". "If you are not satisfied with the equipment you bought (within an inspection period), we will refund 100% of the purchase price immediately upon return of the item."

This is for used machinery! There are some customers out there that know alot of people and have really big mouths when it comes to negative stuff. We simply cannot afford that.

The cost to replace that hull and otherwise make you happy is less than ONE NASCAR RACE MOTOR for Bass Pro Shops and TRACKER Boats founder Johnny Morris..

Johnny, HELLO!, Make this right. These people pay for your stuff, dude. You should be thinking about making these new hulls, the famous "Johnny Morris Hulls". For now you're imfamous....

You could take a lesson from Bennett Marine, maker of the best trim tabs in the industry. If nothing else, they stand alone at the TOP OF THE INDUSTRY with their customer service and satisfaction. Tracker should be doing that too! They can afford NOT to...

Get a grip or sell the SeaCraft group to some who cares...

Re: Tracker has a BIG problem!
 

This whole ordeal is such a Fiasco on Trackers part!
Amen ! Sick'em Otto http://www.click-smilies.de/sammlung...smiley-047.gif

Re: Tracker has a BIG problem!
 

It would have been SOOOO easy for them (still can be) to replace that hull ..... Not to mention the good press/PR they would have received as a result of that. Its no secret when a manufacturer steps up to the plate and “rights a wrong” …PEOPLE TAKE NOTICE … PEOPLE GAIN CONFIDENCE IN THAT PRODUCT…PEOPLE BUY THAT PRODUCT ..Its hard to say, since we all have a passion for these boats, but I wouldn’t want anything to do with a manufacturer that couldn't or wouldn’t stand behind their product

I'm confused
 

I feel badly for all the problems you're having but I'm confused on a few points.
Did you buy this boat from Tracker as a 3+ year old leftover (as in never in the water), or from another party as a used boat?
Does their warranty state that it transfers to new owners?

I guess I'm just wondering if some yahoo might have bought the boat, beat it to crap by going airbound, etc, then sold it to you.

I'd like to know before I jump on the bandwagon to tar and feather Tracker.

Re: I have a little problem?!?
 

I recently spoke with a muckety-muck at Pro-Line here in Citrus County, and he says that there was a 2 month period where SeaCraft made some real crappy boats in the 25' and 32' models, just prior to moving the production from south Florida to the Mako plant in Sc or NC. (I can't remember which)
Seems the workers in the Dade facility didn't like being told their jobs were going to be eliminated, and stopped caring about their work, and may have deliberatly produced poor quality boats over the last 2 months of production in that plant.
On the other hand, The Pro-Line guy took a tour of the new, state of the art computerized production facility for Mako and SeaCraft, and says it has the potential to be, quote, "just about the best small boat production facility out there", endquote.
The question is, will they make good on their current problems with the 25's and 32's?

Re: I'm confused
 

I bought the boat used. It had 99 hours on the engines. I was TOLD by Bass Pro Shop employee's that the hull warranty was transferable, I was TOLD it was transferred into my name; I have e-mails mails that state I have warranty coverage. When I asked when the warranty ran out they found it was not transferable in 1999, it is on newer boats, but not in 1999. So when they found that out they told me I am no longer entitled to warranty.

Re: I'm confused
 

Well, I got a reply last Friday. After sending a survey by a certified marine surveyor a survey that states the boat is unsafe and unsound plus an estimate from one of Tracker Marine Group's repair shops, a shop that gave me an estimate of $21,000 to repair the transom and start...START looking under the deck to locted all the rest of problem the hull has.....They say the boat only has a small cosmetic crack on the top of the transom and the boat is "seaworthy".

My extended warranty (also part of Tracker Marine Group) company stated that the transom is not part of the hull and is not covered under the extended warranty and that if it was....Tracker Marine Warranty says there is no problem to fix!

Can you beleive that $hit!

Re: I'm confused
 

company stated that the transom is not part of the hull

What the hell is it a part of then ??? The center console??? Keep after them Capn Chuck!!!

Re: I'm confused
 

I have a friend who had a 2001 32 seacraft that he had to give away in the 50 grand area because the bulk head was cracked among other problems. He was the second owner and the boat had every option available with only 500 hrs on the optis.

Re: I'm confused
 

Captn C - for 21k . . . . you could have a boat builder pull a mold off your hull and build you a brand new 25ft. What a bunch of losers!!!

Re: I'm confused
 

I sent them an e-mail yesterday asking them to define the word "hull" and give me a list of the what they consider to be parts of the hull.

In my mind I break it down like this- A hull is the main part of boat....A boat is a device that floats....SO, you should be able to remove every part that is not part of the hull and it still be able to maintain its main function, which is to float! NO transom-no float!

I sent the President of Tracker Marine an e-mail yesterday stating how I felt about their company. My big gripe, which I think will stand up in court of law, is 9 different employees of either Bass Pro Shop or Tracker Marine have told me I had warranty, had the warranty transferred into my name or replied to other peoples e-mail that they have honored the transfer of my warranty. Then when they found out that the warranty was non-transferable in 1999 they have claimed I never had any warranty.

I also stated I would never bought a boat that had cracks 16 days after the original owner bought it if I had not been told the warranty was transferable. I would have either not bought the boat or had everything repaired before I bought it. Thats a no brainer!

I have dozens of e-mails which state "I only have structural warranty", but now they are saying they will fix the little crack in the gelcoat on the top of the transom which is only cosmetic. Those same e-mails states "my warranty does not cover cosmetic cracks".

Bigshrimpin,
I have already thought about doing that same thing. If I knew more about doing it I would give it a try myself.

Re: I'm confused
 

You wrote that you bought the boat used, but did Tracker handle the sale? Or was it from a private party?

Re: I'm confused
 

One of Bass Pro Shop sales people knew about the boat and told me about it when I was there looking at a new SeaCraft. Then I had them check the boat/motors out because the boat was originally bought there and they should know a little about the boat. I felt they would know what to look for in there own boat if there was any problems with it.

So the short of it is the only money Bass Pro Shop took from me was the money spent to check the boat out. The purchase was between me and the owner.

Re: I'm confused
 

So, to summarize if I've got this right, you have a 3+ year old boat that is falling apart. Presumably because it was not manufactured properly (vs. abused)
-You had it surveyed and it was given a clean bill of health prior to the purchase.
-You obtained written correspondence from that warrantor prior to the sale that the warranty is transferable to you.
-You haven't read the warranty and it seems that it does not cover the transom issue. BTW, it's not a matter of what you think should be covered, it only matters what the document says, like an insurance contract.

It seems that if the warrantee does not cover the issue, you may have recourse against the surveyor, who happens to be the same as the manufacturer.

Why hasn't this been turned over to a lawyer?

Re: I'm confused
 

They, Both Bass Pro Shop/Tracker Marine, have said the damage was not caused by abuse. Of course now they are saying there is no damage.

How can you get an estimate of $21,000 if nothing is broken?

The written statments of warranty came after I bought the boat. I transferred the extended warranty after I bought the boat.

The boat was not surveyed per say only inspected before I bought it.

The extended warranty only says "hull and stringers" with no definition of what a hull is...that is why I e-mailed them yesterday to define what they consider a hull to be. I had them send me the paper work with the fine print on it and it still doesn't say what a hull is. The transom is not excluded in the area were it lists exclusions.

Plain and simple they are trying to wiggle out of standing behind a product that was not manufactured properly.

I am actively seeking a lawyer now.

Re: I'm confused
 

Good luck on getting an attorney. I hope that you have strong consumer laws in Texas.

Re: I'm confused
 

The practical deifintion of a "hull" THE EFFIN PIECE THAT KEEPS THE WATER ON THE OUTSIDE AND THE REST OF THE CRAP ON THE INSIDE!!!! Captn C - this burns me - bad. Will you PLEASE get an attorney...

Re: I'm confused
 

Roger that...