What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

OK I know that the 70-80 are classic "Potter Hulls". However what "IF" I got a real clean 89 at a fair price. What is the main difference, and out there on the water is there really any difference? Just would like some honest opinions from the owners out there.

Thanks.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Based on your previous posts,I know your looking at Sceptre models. I have been advised that some of late 80's Sceptre's had a "Hook" in the hull caused by using a retired mold. Check the Port side between the chines at the transom. Lay a 4' straight edge fore & aft. You will see it if pronounced. The Potter era hulls are consistant in their construction. The later years have had many surprises :eek:

BTW: Any hull can have or have had problems. Judging the quality of a hull only by it's year is foolish. "Clean Looking" does not always mean "Structural and Mechanically Sound" Get a moisture meter and hire a good marine surveyor & engine Mechanic and don't be afraid to stick your nose where it doesn't belong. Most cosmetics can be repaired ;)

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Thanks for the "hook" information. As far as digging in, I have done that plenty, clean to me means not a piece of junk. So far all I have seen out there is junk. I do not mind working on a boat, but I do not want to make it my life's work, :) Other than that what other surprise's has any one heard about.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Isl Trader

Remember this site is geared to the "Classic SeaCraft" years. Not much is discussed about newer SeaCrafts other than common boat configs. Some construction issues with the Tracker Built hulls have been mentioned. Forum member "NTRAIN2K" is a Tracker employee. I would shoot him a PM with your questions. He is generaly lurking around this site.

BTW: Click here-------> Horror Story for some reading for while your on the pot :eek:

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Boats come down to design, materials and workmanship. The only other variable is what happens to it after it's sold, and how well it's maintained/abused.

The design and materials are pretty consistent from year to year/boat to boat. As you get newer, from CSY forward, the rigging got cheaper and cheaper, and the workmanship varied more from boat to boat. Some good, some not so good. I have seen some older boats that had some sloppy workmanship, but not as many. Maybe the sloppy ones didn't survive, I don't know.

Back to design, most Sceptres have water coming in through the scuppers. IMHO, many of these older boats have wet coring/wood in them, and people have put much larger/heavier engines on them, than what they originally were designed for. This combination makes them sit low in the back. The raybud scuppers fix this problem.

All the SeaCrafts have the same design hull, but there were tweaks in the caps/liners over the years. Personally, I like the later Sceptre caps/layouts better. As for the “hull hook”, I will have to check that one out. I thought the Sceptres and CC hulls came out of the hull’s same mold, but I could be wrong. Capt Chuck, is this unique to Sceptres? Or all late 80’s boats?

There are 3 things I don't like about all the Scepters.

1. Open transom. With the boat sitting low/heavy in the back, if 3 people all run to a corner to look at a fish coming up, water comes in. Also, we do alot of power drifting with the back of the boat into the waves/current, and this can be wet and sloppy. From a safety perspective, if you lose power, the back of the boat is going to swing into the current/waves, and this could get dangerous, in seas over 3'. I am putting a bracket on mine, and closing in the transom, for safety, as much as anything else.
2. No insulated fish box. The CC's have nice fish boxes, although uninsualted in the front. You give that up with a Sceptre. The early ones don’t have boxes under the seats, the newer ones do. That area under the seats is pretty much dead space on the older boats. I have been using insulated fish bags, and they work great. I am replacing my in floor live well with an insulated fish box. It won't be huge, but it should do.
3. In floor live well. These tend to over flow onto the deck, and are a safety issue when the well is open. When I do charters, I am very careful that guest don't fall into the livewell with the lid open. It is also not much fun crawling around on your hands and knees trying to get a bait out of the well in any kind of seas. I am relocating mine to the transom area.

As far as the classic vs the late 80’s. The transoms seem to be a problem in most old boats of this design. The condition of the wood is dependent on how old it is, how wet it is, and how many improperly sealed holes have been drilled in it. There are not many boats over 10 years old, with wood transoms, that aren’t wet, and there are very few over 20, that don’t need a transom overhaul. Once you get back into the 70’s or earlier, your looking at one that needs to be overhauled, or trusting that the guy that did it knew what he was doing (and did it). If I was buying an pre-85 SeaCraft, I would look for one with a replaced transom, preferably filled in transom with bracket, or I would budget one in. The budget would probably be 4-7k, depending on whether you do it yourself, or pay someone. Wiring in a boat over 20 years old needs to be replaced, in most cases. If it hasn’t been rewired, it probably will. Steering controls, seacocks, gastanks, and a whole bunch of other stuff usually starts to go at 15-20 years old, so be prepared. If your looking at buying something that is safe/serviceable to use, and repair as you go along, you might want to look at a late 80’s. If you looking at an unrestored pre-80’s plan on spending a lot of time and money.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

I have to agree with you about the weight for the design potter built.My brother inlaw 20 CC with 140 4 stroke susuki sit scary low and then you fill his bait well and put people in the back and its worse. I posted some picks last month with him pulling about a 100 lb jew fish up next to the boat and you can see in the pictures how low it sits.He can not pull the plugs for his thru hull drains on the deck without the boat deck filling with water.My 1973 23 CC with 200 yamaha 2 stroke sits I believe the way it was designed to. I can leave my deck plugs out all the time with no issues of flooding the decks,this is nice because we are always rinsing the deck for fish blood and it gos right out. I here about people raising the decks on the 20 but I think the gunnels are already low when standing in his boat.The way I see it no matter what changes you make you made your best decision when you bought a seacraft. Keith

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Thanks for the in depth information.

The thing I am having a hard time finding is that elusive hull. It's tuff to justify spending 8-12 grand for a boat that has a 6k motor on it 2k for the trailer and 3-4k for a re-do hull. I know you can take the motor off an ebay it, however thats a crap shoot.

I just thought the 89 would be 10 years newer, and in better shape. However they seem to all fall into that if its over 20 years....we all have the same problems.

I guess I just want a Hull and trailer and do it my way or a
real nice re-do and pay the piper.

My wife and I just like the set up better in the Sceptre rather than the CC. We fall into the lets cruise first and maybe fish later. So the extra deck space rear is nice.

Still looking. ;)

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

The good news for you is the prices on the Sceptres are almost always less than the center consoles. There have been a couple nice ones in the last year in florida, in the 6-8k range. With the boat market that is out there right now, most folks will take any offer on a 10 year old boat. At least here in Florida, not much is moving. I was looking at a rebuildable 23 Sceptre that could be had for 1500 bucks last week.
Good luck!!

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

I know of a project 78 sceptre on Martha's Vineyard if you are interested.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

We'd all snicker and laugh at you but otherwise you'd have a boat no different from one made ten years earlier :D

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Mark, you know better than that, I hope.....

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

FWIW, my personal favorites are the 1981-1985. :D

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Thanks but Martha's is a long way to go from Sarasota FL.

Now I have expanded my search to include a 20' Seafari.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Classic SeaCraft means you put a 15k motor and 15k worth of time and material into a 10k boat that the insurance company now tells you it is work 10K :D. Actually, for me, the Sceptre/Tsunami is the classic, no matter what year, because no one makes a boat like that anymore. They are all center console or walkarounds.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

well put. but we all need a hobby.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

There are actually significant structural differences, mostly after Tracker took over. If you do enough searching around the site you'll find'em.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

I read that old thread and after looked at my 86 and I do have a curve in just like that.
I never noticewd it before.
BigMike

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

I wish someone would take a picture and show me this. It's not that I don't believe it, I just would like to see what it looks like.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

It just sways in the last four feet like a bent piece of plywood. I will try in the next couple of days to get a good picture. The new ones don't have that at all.
So it was about the year mine was made. Not a big deal except now I see it every time I walk by.
It's on the starboard side, but the port is in the shade so I can't see it on that side.
BigMike

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

I read all this stuff about a 20 year old boat and it gets depressing. My 1989 23WA SeaCraft is as good as it was the day I bought it new. It has been stored inside except when I am on the water using it. I guess some people must just trash their boats. The only dilema I have is, that some days I am going to have to repower and it will cost me as much as I paid for the package (boat/motor/trailer). I still get lots of compliments on the boat and hopefully will keep for many more years unless health problems arise, never know when you hit the mid 60's.
I could have had a Septre model when I got mine, but just like the WA. That boat went to Alaska, so I presume it is still up there.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

Numerous members here have great Tracker hulls and there are documented cases of Potter hulls that were the last one laid up before the weekend that are really sad. I would worry less about what year the hull was than the condition of the actual specific boat you are considering buying. These things were made by humans.....as such, a good bit of variation exists.

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

O yah. 84' !!!!!!!!! :cool:

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

The flex on my hull won't hurt the performance and the boat is made well.
I just wish I hadn't heard about it and may never have looked.LOL

Re: What is the difference? Classic vs. 89
 

[/QUOTE]
I wish someone would take a picture and show me this. It's not that I don't believe it, I just would like to see what
it looks like.

[/QUOTE]

Here's an 85 Scepter I looked at last Sunday that definitely has the hook in port center panel (first picture below). I only had a 2' straightedge, but biggest gap was about 1' fwd of transom. Gap was about 1/16 to 1/8". Longer straightedge might show a bigger gap. Appeared to be a slight hollow spot in port inner panel also, but was by myself and had a hard time holding straightedge and taking photo at same time! http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z...epter23001.jpg Port outer panel is straight. http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z...epter23012.jpg I thought I remembered that all stbd panels were straight, but after looking at this shot of innermost stbd panel again, it also appears to show a very slight hook or hollow spot, a little further fwd than port side. http://i188.photobucket.com/albums/z...epter23006.jpg
Hope this clarifies the issue of the hook in some post-Potter hulls! Denny