Brass scupper tube install
 

Didn't want to hijack the other thread,but I'm getting ready to install new brass scupper tubes into my Tsunami,and have a question.

I replaced both of the wood blocks,and am trying to decide whether I should place the tubes into the blocks with 3M 5200,or thicken up some epoxy resin,and bed them in with that?
I have sealed the holes with epoxy resin so now its just a matter of installing the tubes.

Any recommendations?

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

John123,

I suppose it's been done a number of ways but since you've already replaced the blocks and sealed the scuppers sleeves with epoxy you may as well use 5200 to bed them and seal them. I think the flexibility of that adhesive will be more forgiving, adhere to the brass and sleeve better, and provide a better seal over time than epoxy.

Good luck.

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

McGillicuddy,
Thanks,I was leaning towards the 5200.
What I should have done,when i had the entire rear cap,deck,and transom out(it's an I/O)was to run the drains out the transom.
It still eats away at me that I didn't,but now,everything is finished,and back together,and there's is no way I'm going to attempt that.
I'll leave it stipulated in my will,that My children can not sell it,and that they have to change the scuppers out the transom.
That should keep em busy for a while.

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

I think Bushwacker had overdrilled his holes and blocks for the purpose of both rebuilding the wood blocks with GitRot and then re-drilled the 1 inch holes - effectively making an epoxy sleeve to place the brass in. That way if the brass ever fails again, the deck and hull are are still sealed from water intrusion through the wood block by the epoxy tube that connects them.

Kind of made me wonder why not forgo the the brass sleeve all together and just make a bigger f-glas and epoxy tube?

Great idea on the will by the way, too many kids cough up their parent's prized possessions without thinking what it really meant to the family. Heritage, ancestry, history of the family, man. That's what an inheritance should be about. The legacy of the Family Seacraft... Sounds like youve got it down in the Berkshires :cool:

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

Yea, Gillie, the holes in my wood blocks were about 2" in diameter after I cleaned out all the rot! :eek: So I just sealed bottom of hole, filled the whole thing with thickened epoxy, and then redrilled the hole, but I did use a lot of 5200 on the brass tubes. You do have a good point about eliminating the brass that will eventually corrode. I considered PVC like Big Shrimpin used, but that reduces flow area which I didn't want to do . . if you ever get a big wave over the transom, you're gonna want to get that water out ASAP! The brass tubes were easy and allowed min wall thickness and max flow area, so decided to stick with original configuration. I had previously replaced those tubes about 30 years ago, so I'll let the next owner worry about the ones I just did a couple of years ago! If I was redoing the boat however, I'd go with the Moesly design with the scupper lines crossing under deck and draining out transom on opposite side of boat. Denny

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

Ken (FELLOWSHIP),
Did you consisder cross draining?

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

Ha Knot Working

??? what?? Have I been sleep posting again?

Maybe I have old timers disease.

I have heard of cross dressing but I don’t do things like that.


FellowShip

………………………

Just for the Grins :D :D :D :D

Official Antique Classic SeaCraft Owner

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

John 123

I replace the tubes in my '75 Sceptre but used Life-Caulk instead of 5200. It's more of a caulking than a glue.

I expect to do the next tube replacement and want to be able to get the brass out as easily as the first time.

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

Thanks Mark,
I kind of wondered the same thing,that if I had to replace them,how would I be able to easily get them out.
Originally,I planned on using epoxy to bed them in with,but thought it might be a b--tch to get them out if I had to change them.
I know 5200 is also permanent,so I've been giving some thought to Sika-Flex 291 lot.I use it quite a bit,Its a polyurethane like 5200,but a little less permanent.
I'll look into the life caulk,thanks for the info.

One advantage I have,is that the boat will only see freshwater (the Great Lakes)

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

I think Mark makes a good point. A poly-sulfide like Life Caulk definitely merits consideration especially if you're thinking you might do this again in 10 or 15 years. Lord knows I won't want to compete with 5200 when I'm older. I like the adhesion qualities of 5200 but maybe not its permanence in this application. As far as 3M goes, maybe 4200 is more appropriate. Bushwacker mentioned he'd used Life Caulk the 1st time he changed his scuppers. All we're really doing is creating a seal between fiberglass and brass, right? Get the flare right and tight and I guess that a quality sealant should suffice. The Sika-flex 291 LOT definitely fits the bill... heck of a lot more economical than the 3M products.

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

That may not be an advantage. Wood rots quicker in freshwater than in salt water. I've know old timers with wood boats that put rock salt in the bilge to make sure that any rainwater that got into the bilge became salty!

As for bedding the scupper tubes, 4200 or Sikaflex might be a good compromise. Life Caulk is pretty good stuff and will even cure underwater, but I still ended up with quite a bit of rot in the wood blocks and a significant leak after about 25 years. They also make stuff now that will attack 5200, but might be a challenge to get it in around the scupper tubes!

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

Pardon my 2¢ worth but....
5200 is a great product. When it is used, it is often too good a product. A very good rule for using 5200 is to ask yourself, "Am I ever going to want to take this apart?" If the answer is yes, you might want to find something else.

IMHO, with regards to the scuppers, if it were me I would drill an oversized hole, put tape on the backside and tape on the outside covering the entire hole. Then I would punch a small hole through the tape at the top of the hole and using a large syringe I would fill the hole with epoxy. Let it cure. Drill it to the proper size. Put plenty of caulk on the scupper and seat it in the hole. That way, when you pull the boat you can check/change the caulk. No water should get to that transom. Just my 2¢.

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

Bushwacker,
you're right, wood does rot faster in fresh water,than it does in saltwater.
I had meant to say that the brass tubes would be more likely to corrode quicker in salt water than fresh.

As for changing them,I figure at my age,they should last me plenty long enough,and if not,I'll have someone else do the work.
After that,it's the kids problem.

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

I talked to a project manager down at one of the local boat yards today and ran the scupper sealant by him. He said Sika-flex 291 is what they use for sealing all through-hulls and anything that might need to come out someday. You were right in your thinking - Sorry about suggesting the 5200, what was I thinking? Your kids would've killed me. :D

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

This is a handy guide...

If you can't read it send me pm and I will email you the pdf file for easier reading.



http://i266.photobucket.com/albums/i...er/Sealant.jpg

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

I've been wrestling with what product to use also but I think I am going with life-caulk. It can be applied under water, meaning it should be compatible with wet wood, and never completely hardens. I bought the 5200 but think I will save that for another job.
I owe it to the guys on this site for making me carefully check my scuppers. Mine were clearly deteriorated. I got the old ones out by breaking off the flare(It crumbled off) then drove them out with a 1" birch dowel and a hammer. If it ever stops snowing I'll get the new ones in.

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

life-caulk has never failed me it even stoped us from sinking when a thru hull fitting failed and the life-caulk held it in!!!

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

FELLOW-SHIP,
I guess you are aging.
Nice reply.
As usuall.

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

You're right about that Denny

I've been changing planks on the lobster boat and she's in alot worse shape above the waterline than below. The washboards are also pretty rough in spots due to rainwater sitting ontop.

Now I'm no oldtimer but I do put salt in the bilge...but only when stored in winter. In the summer I don't have to worry about it because salt water comes in almost as quickly as it goes out :D :D

here are a couple of pics of the old girl
[image]http://i446.photobucket.com/albums/q...b/CIMG2217.jpg[/image]
[image]http://i446.photobucket.com/albums/q...b/CIMG2247.jpg[/image]

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

I love the plumb bow and sheer line.

Who is the maker of that style boat?

Re: Brass scupper tube install
 

She is a Cape Egmont built in Prince Edward Island (Egmont Bay). I don't think they're in business anymore...I've tried looking them up. I see the odd one for sale but have never seen one newer than 92. I think mine is an 82 or 83 according to the previous owner. No title or hin plate.