New Yamaha 4 Stroke
 

Just read an article in Boating Magazine about repowering and the problems of putting a heavy 4 stroke on an older boat not designed for them. Very interesting considering I repowered two summers ago and faced that very problem. I eventually went from a Merc Optimax 200 to a Etec 175 and lost about 75 lbs in the process. I'm very pleased with the Etec but was surprised to learn that apparently Yamaha has come out with a new lighter 4 stroke 200 that only weighs 487 lbs. which is just about what my old Opti weighed. So I guess there is hope that more options will follow for others like myself that have to repower and could not consider any 4 strokes due to weight concerns.

glanced at the same article from what the said the removed the iron sleaves and sprayed the holes like the did with the old merc black max 200. very hard walls but if something should score them i think its a new block

Another article in Boating Magazine shows that the 4-strokes cost surprisingly MORE to operate than a DI 2-stroke! http://www.boatingmag.com/engines/ou...MjQ1NDU1MzI5S0 Even with the 2-stroke using expensive full synthetic oil, the relatively small savings in 4-stroke fuel costs isn't nearly enough to offset their higher maintenance costs. And this doesn't even consider the cost of the required valve lash check/adjustment on the 4-strokes at 500 hrs. If they had run the analysis for 600 hrs instead of 300, the operating cost difference would have been even more obvious!

If you do your own crankcase oil and lower unit changes you beat the Etec by a long stretch. Using their figures for parts and labor was a slanted atempt for a interesting claim but has little to no real world proof. If you really want to compare ownership costs you need to look at duty service cycles between the engines. Longevity is what truely pays dividends.

I ain't gittin drug into this 2 stroke / 4 stroke battle and I want to stay fair and balanced on this topic, BUT 1) all the oil used to leak out of the Homelight 55 crank case seals and they would explode on a regular basis and 2) you can beat a "water cooled chain saw" for the HP, weight and internal moving parts component combination. (they lowered the ports on the E-Tec's and they have more mid-range torque than a John Deere.....!)
OK, so I'm glad I didn't get dragged into that old argument.

"OK, so I'm glad I didn't get dragged into that old argument"

Speaking of dragging.....the 200 E-tec, especially the HO model, will drag a 4 cylinder 200hp 4-stroke Yamaha allover the ocean. No comparison, no competition........period. Heck, the 200 HO E-tec blows away even the 225 Yamaha in power.

In 10 years one of the two won't be here to compare to. :D We'll be debating 4 strokes vs. boosted diesel outboards.

I seem to remember folks saying 2-strokes were going away back in 2000 when OMC went bankrupt. Although E-TECs are now No. 3 on new boat sales behind Yamaha and Merc, they're No. 1 in repower sales, so they've made an impressive comeback.

Speaking of bankruptcy, I see that Suzuki has pulled out of the US auto market. I'd sure hope they don't abandon the outboard market, as they're my favorite 4S design, and were my 2nd choice for a motor. Their use of an oil bath chain cam drive and the offset crank/extra gear reduction to compensate for less torque sure makes a lot of sense!

Don't count out 2-strokes yet.

Mercury has been working with a higher compression version of their 3.0L air-injected (read: supercharged) 2-stroke multi-fuel motor (based upon the Optimax) which, when burning a JP8/Syntroleum blend, has significantly lower emissions than any current 4-stroke V6 outboard, and is comparable in emissions burning any of the kerosene-based fuels, except No.2 diesel, where it lags only slightly when burning summer blends of diesel.

I understand their initial target market is the military and LEO, but still, it sounds promising.

While the test motors are burning seven different fuels: Jet A1, JP5, JP8, JP8/Syntroleum blend, No.2 Diesel, 93 octane gasoline, and paraffin oil (kerosene-alkane oil), I am told the eventual fuel selection will be limited to 3 grades, which will absolutely include JP5, but probably NOT include gasoline, (even though it will still run fine on a 50-50 blend of gas and No.2 diesel, or gas and kerosene).

The engineer I know who works for Mercury says the difficulty isn't getting the motor to run on any of these fuels, it's programming the computer fuel management system to get similar power outputs from the same injectors regardless of the fuel being used. For instance, they've only been able to get 160-165 hp out of the No.2 diesel and about 180 out of the paraffin, but the JP8/Syntroleum and gasoline configurations have given them 220-230 hp before running into either emission or detonation issues.

Evinrude also has a multi-fuel V6 in testing, but I have no information on that.

Oh yeah, Mercury has a 2.6L Verado tuned to 400 hp that has passed the 2500 hour mark :-) That's the equivalent of 150,000 miles for a car.

BRP has been selling small 2 cyl. motors to the USN for several years http://www.evinrude.com/en-US/engine...ENGINES/MFE_55

They don't want gasoline on their assault ships, but want to run their outboards on the same JP-5 they use in the Harriers and helicopters!

Breaker, Breaker Good Buddy, All you 2-Stroke boys turn down your 8 tracks for a minute and listen up. You are livin' in the last century George Jetson; get with the program. You can't take some 'ol school Evinrude Star-Flight, remove the cowling with 4 after burners on it, replace the garbage disposal carbs with selonid powered speaker like fuel injectors, bolt an upgraded game boy on the side of it and call it 'cutt'in edge technology....! It's still a dumb 'ol motor with fuel injection, an EEM and a new plastic cowling. Soon you'll be graduat'in from your sounding lead to a 4" Gemtronics paper machine and an Sitex "C" Loran. (Good luck bringing up that 14 and 44 line)

I thought I had a Procal Harum 8 track somewhere. My Homelite Bearcat may have eaten it.
Never trust a Crosley.

Ah the smell of old paper machines, I hear they are selling them again in Colorado.

The good news is being made by big petro. Lubes have come a long way in 30 years. The metallurgists are also doing amazing work. Shame they shuttered NASA.
Algae diesel is another ringer in the game. Just getting started, but I think it could be a great alternative. FPL is leasing land to a start up on the beach.

I still see old Rudes, Mercs, and Yams from the 80`s and some from the 70`s.
Can you retrofit I pod docks to old smokers?

Listen Sandy, we now got a complicated health Care system, a complicated tax system, a complicated flood insurance system, and complicated on-line dating to boot - ya' need a dang complicated outboard motor too, otherwise they'll be some kind of cosmic shift and it'll start getting really cold when there's supposed to be "Climate Change" going on. You wouldn't want that to be "Your Fault" or Morgan and Morgan will git a class action going.

Besides, speaking of things that smell funny, why do those E-tec's pump two gallons less than the volume of the Niagara Falls for cooling? Gee wiz, they have to be ingesting thousands redfish, trout, snook and permit larvae and cook'in them in the blocks....! I think maybe there needs to be some kind of study do to see if a mitigation hatchery needs to be constructed and paid for by those thirsty E-Tec's. They're probably contributing to the the "Climate Change" by warming the oceans too much with all that cooling water they use.

We need to appoint a government committee to look into this because somehow, I'm sure we're not paying enough to be Gov-erned properly.

Wish I had unlimited funds, for now I'm gotta keep the outboard budget in the market earning $$$ and keep listening to my 1986 walkman crank out 2 stroke tunes. One mans trash is another mans treasure ;)

http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/...3133.sized.jpg
http://www.wellcraftv20.com/gallery/...3223.sized.jpg

Wow . . . just read that article.

Spark Plugs: $146.00
Water Pump: $375.00

????????????????

Same job done yourself on a 1980's blackmax = under $40 in parts and less than 1 hour of your time.


NGK BU8H plugs cost $2.25 each (5 minutes of labor)

Water Pump is $25.98 with the housing delivered ( 45 minutes going slow )
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Water-Pump-I...-/300996123884

For those engines in the link, it is about FAR more than just the fuel they burn.

Dang Bigshrimpin, What the heck kind of underground bunker BlackMax machine shop do you have tucked away up there in the Commomwealth of
Massachusets??? You got to be breaking some kind of local zoning codes with that whole operation in your cellar. First time I ever seen a BlackMax "Hoarder".

Don't you know the US switched from a "Manufacturing" based Economy to a "Service" based Economy. What the heck are you do'in first of all running those 'ol USA made rattl'in 2 strokes that never break and then when they do, you fix 'em yourself. Your supposed to be trad'in dollars with other Americans to turn your hamberbers over, mow you lawn, wash your car, adjust the valve lash on your 4 stroke outboard motor and do other important stuff like that. You got to buy into this "Service" aspect! This economy would take off if it wasn't for guys like you mess'in it up and going it alone. Here all along I been blam'in those knuckleheads in Washington all along and the whole log-jam is Bigshrimpin up in Marblehead.

Nothing beats an old "Tower of Power"....

1973 Mercury inline 6 "XS1500" 1.6L (99ci) when spun up to 9200 RPM could produce 205 crankshaft hp, more than 2 hp per cubic inch! and at only 257 lbs, produced .8 hp per lb.

It'll scare the crap out of you the 1st time you hear them turn rpm's that high, though. Sounds like movie audio of something going hyper-critical just before it blows up the whole planet.

hey everyone
 

hello

Yep, those are some pretty outragous prices but the actual cost for maintaince parts is not really that different for any modern outboard. I do my own water pump once a year whether it needs it or not. That plugs, and zinc. My water pump only takes about 30 to 40 minutes as well and I have yet to ever require a housing. Full kit: $34.98...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Water-Pump-I...-/300979087956
As far as oil changes go I spend whatever 8 quarts of Rotella costs from Sam's and a $5 fram filter from Wally world. Pump out, screw off, screw on, pour in, have another beer and light a cigar..... Even an old Merc guy could do it. :D That article is pretty laughable... The same people writing that rag think cat hulls are the greatest thing since sliced bread as well and write dozens of pages proving that too.....

The original motor on my rig a a 275 V8 2 smoker. I don't think you could pour gas and oil overboard faster than it could burn it. At a 28 knot cruise it barely got 1 nautical per gallon on a flat day. It did have it's good points though... It was reliable as the sunrise and nobody could follow you to your spot due to the toxic fog bank trailing 2 nautical miles behind. The best feature was the cowl! If needed it would double as a 7 man life raft or could be traded in Cuba for a pallet of Cohiba churchhills and 2 dozen hot empanadas.

Now I only get 2 nautical and a 30 knot cruise and none of the above fringe benefits.... What was I thinking...

Yes Sir the old V-8 OMC engines required a 1/2" fuel line. :) Back in 1986 or so one of the local OMC dealers here in Gibsonton put two of these monsters on the back of a 29' Aquasport, made a few magazines as an alternative to I/Os. Did NOT last long, I asked them why they took them off and they told me the boat did not a big enough gas tank to feed them.

Man, I love the smell of napalm on a Monday morning. Keep up the 4 strk 2 strk battle...I love it!

There ain't noth'in to over-com'in the weight of a 4 stroke on that MA that 15 or 20 bags of Sackrete in the anchor locker wouldn't overcome. She'll just look a little like a Low-Rider with 10" of freeboard or maybe you'll just look like Dorf in a Flats Boat. Just git ya' some dingle balls to hang around 'ur Tee Top. And don't go in the flats 'cause you'll be drawing three and half feet of water with that rig. Bearcat Lovers!

Yep, Seems like even the older model Zukes have enough torque to get the job done... :D

How did that white orphan get past security and more importantly what year and hp is it?

seafari being pulled looks just like shana boat cool runnin

Hey Sandy.....looks like one of those where the mailman was involved!!! But it's a fair question of the family heritage! :)

Milk man? Such pretty times. A full cord of Mercs.

Cheers,
GFS

That's funny right there....