Suzuki DF300 AP Club: Moose Sled 2.0
 

After a 12 year run with my previous DF250 I thought there was no way I would ever want for more out of an outboard. I always had more power than I ever wanted or could use and at an overall fuel burn of 2 nautical I was very content. That was until I saw Danny's new white stallion at the last gathering. The Admiral was equally impressed and I made mention that if anything ever happened to the 250 I would prefer to step up to the 300 with fly by wire controls. Little did we know that same day we were plagued offshore with a cable and linkage failure that kept us from a second day on the water. When we got back home I tore the linkage down and found a few worn pieces that were causing the issue and got her back in working order. Mel asked if anything else could give us an issue in the future? Covered in sweat and grease I replied "It's going on 12 years so what do YOU think!". Her reply was quick... let's just get a new one!

I can't say there was much hesitation on my end and I started looking into it. It wasn't long before I squared away the funding and contacted Mike at International Marine Service who put me on schedule for the first of the year. It was a great buying experience as Mike and his team are top notch. The install went smooth and every one of my meticulous expectations were met to the letter. After dropping my sled off the week before we returned the following weekend to find my motor had just arrived and they had it bolted up in no time.

Now for the fun part.... That evening they water tested the boat and everything looked pretty good but I insisted on the 20" prop. The next day I swapped to the 18.5" as I have a 20" at the house and will be able to use it if after break in and motor adjustments if it works out that way.

Below are some screenshots from my plotter on the initial break in runs. On a couple of short WOT blasts yielded 42 knots at 5700 very lightly loaded with the 20" and 42 knots at 5900 with the 18.5". Sorry, the blasts were too short to grab a screen shot as you pretty much have too hold on tight when you drop the hammer.

All these screenshots were made with the 18.5" prop. Tide affected the numbers depending on which way I was running so take that into consideration as well as varied trim angle as well.

More...

Congrats on the new motor, I'm sure you will enjoy it! It's got me thinking...but my motor is only 28 years old!!...LOL!

The Admiral didn't waste any time putting a few coats of wax on her new toy! She also put two coats on the hull and cap after a good scrub. I don't know where she gets the energy...

Not really any bigger than the 250...

A keeper she is!

I know that I asked the first time that we met.., but does Mel have a little Sister? Just kidding. She is the bomb. Philly and all. Best of luck with the new engine, auto pilot and .45!

Michael.

Hey Ken, just to let you know....I hate both you and Danny!!!!! :) :) Being jealous is bad....


But I love Mel!!!! :D

The green eyed monster
 

Ken-Is Briguy making you a 300AP card for your wallet? I hear it has the CSC logo in a hologram in the background, lol :D. Mel is the bomb!
Don-You have a very strong reliable motor....17k is better in an investment acct. I've got safe options for it....I worked the new motor discussion for over a year with the boss. Luke Skywalker has nothing on my Jedi mind tricks....one more time "you must have a Suzuki 300AP".

Yes, there is no doubt Mel is the bomb but I didn't just sit around and watch her. While she was waxing away I spent the day freeing up my adjustable bracket that hadn't moved in 9 years. :D I have the motor moved up a full inch to see what that does. In retrospect I wished I would have bolted a new one on while everything was apart. That thing was just about to the point of being welded together.

Can't wait to give it another try this coming weekend. This time it will be with a full trip load in home waters conditions. Numbers from this run will really tell me what I have. Empty boat runs are great for gatherings and channel races for the ramp but the fine tuning I'm concerned with will be focused on speeds from 18 to 32 knots with a loaded boat. From limited testing so far I feel the new motor will really shine in my real world requirements.

I must say Ken was a true pleasure to work with. He knows his boat and he really know his stuff for sure. Both him and his lovely wife were amazing and we look forward to seeing him on the water and at the boat shows again soon. It really makes us very happy when we have such a positive experience with people. Makes it all worth it it in the end.

I will say we all think he is totally crazy for spear fishing at 400 feet but that is whole other discussion LOL.

If we can ever help anyone here please feel free to reach out to me directly, we enjoy what we do and love reading about how much you guys enjoy the boats.

Mike

Ken,
How much time on the motor now?

About 8 hours.... I would have to look. Going to put some on it this weekend.

I think you may see a .2 to .3 mpg increase and maybe 100 to 200 rpm's as you break her in another 2-3 trips. I plan on doing a few hours myself over the weekend.

Took her out for a few hours today. 140 gallons of fuel and 3 people, coolers and assorted gear and hit 41 knots at 5900. My cavitation plate was about 1/2" above the surface at cruise speed at minimal trim. No cavitation at hard turns.... Perfect. I'm locking it down from here with the 18.5" prop. Good to go. 11 hours on the motor so it could only get better with time. Happy, Happy.

Impressive motor. With full fuel and 3 people. at any speed from 16K-29K, maintains a solid 2.6nmpg efficiency. Sweet!

Here's a screen shot from the other day. Not bad for hauling 140 gallons of fuel and 3 people.

With 2.6 mpg and 140 fuel...... You don't always need enough fuel to get to Cuba and
back!!!!!!!!

Seriously! Unless you're heading on an overnigter, no reason to keep more then
75 gallons on board. All the rest which is like 500 lbs just kills performance.

Drop to 60 gallons, and up 20 hours and you'll see 6100 and 44kts.

Drop to 60 gallons, and up 20 hours and you'll see 6100, 44kts and 3.5
mpg. My buddy repowered his heavier 24 Walkaround proline and is seeing
those numbers with the 18.5

Its more of a convenience thing for me. Affordable Rec 90 is kind of a pain to deal with in filling her up. The way I see it I should get 3 trips from a tank. My average trip runs a little over 100 nautical so as weight decreases and performance increases I should realize a substantial savings across the board. The way I see it I should gain a full extra trip with every tankful and then some. Looking forward to seeing how it all acts on a real world trip.

I'm not too sure I can compare numbers with the proline. I don't think the deadrise and width factors are the same and the gear and ice load profile of my trips is pretty extreme.

Update: Made it to 20 hours mid way through my last trip. Took about 20 minutes to find in the manual how to turn the alarm off. I was 40 nautical offshore when it flipped and didn't anticipate what I saw on the 10 mile run to my next spot. While cruising along in well spaced 2' seas I took a glance at my fuel burn to notice I went from 2.3 nautical to 2.6 at the same speed I was running prior to the 20 hour mark. I swung it around and proceeded to head back in the opposite direction thinking maybe tide or wind provided the gain but to no avail it was still seeing the improvement. Coming about again I charged on to the next spot varying running speeds seeing the same general .2-.3 improvement in fuel burn.

Being a little technical in nature I knew something didn't just magically happen with the break in of the motor. My only conclusion is that the ECM must change fuel mapping after the break in period and lean up the profile. I am thinking the "lean burn" function of the motor is probably locked out until 20 hours is reached. Anyway, what was already great just got a lot better and may explain what others have seen after break in on theirs.

Props
 

Kmoose,

I've read everything you've posted regarding your boat, the 300 Zuke and your prop selection. Many thanks for your contributions. I have the same boat although a few differences in our restorations. I have a hard top and upper station but my fuel tank is 115 gallons so the net difference in weight may not be that much more.

I am about to order my 300 Suzuki and I am struggling with how to ensure I have the best prop. I hate to spend the money on a new Powertech prop only to find out I should have ordered something else from them. I see you went with the LFS 16 x 18 in a 3-blade but you also said it was a bit "under propped". By under propped, I believe you are saying that you could have used a bit more pitch (18.5 possibly??). Is this correct? If my boat is slightly heavier than yours, I would assume that the 16 x 18 would be just about right. What are your thoughts?

Why did you not go with a 4-blade?

I am going to call Powertech this week and see what they recommend. I am hopeful they can recommend a prop to me once I provide them with the details of my boat.

Here is a pic of my boat. I have the Hermco single bracket.

https://i.imgur.com/lHRqA5p.jpg?1

(I know my trim tabs are too far inboard but I'm gonna let it ride and see if it is manageable before cutting holes in my bracket.)

Sweet boat!! Ken at Prop Gods will allow you to send back and try to get the right one. Cost a few $$$ in shipping but you're not stuck with it unless you damage it.

I believe if you look through Moose's posts he went with a Bravo prop and says the Zuke is "singing a new tune"..........

Great looking boat....Moose has a 4 blade bravo 1. I have the Zuk 18.5 on my Sceptre with DF 300AP. I would start with your 18 or 18.5 with your weight and CG differences (your forward weight will put your chines in the water forward of where Ken's does) . I am transom mounted, but I am barely hitting 5950rpms. Correct prop should produce between 6-6300rpm. EricB also has a tower-but transom mounted also.

I’ll give anyone who wants it a very good deal on the 18 power tech. And yes I’m running a Bravo one but the smallest non custom pitch is 22”. I hit 6000 with a light load but I don’t give max rpm much creadence. The torque curve on a 300 is next to flat from 5800 to 6300 so rpm range is pretty much a weak guide. Best fuel economy at desired cruise speed is the best prop indicator.

2 strokes Vs 4 strokes with VVT and fuel injection. Not the same animals. With 14 years of propping both Yamaha and Zuke 4 stroke outboards I can tell you fuel efficiency at loaded cruise is your primary factor and has no play on engine longevity.

I think we agree that the corect range of rpm will still happen (heavy load at cruise with best fuel efficiency or heavy load getting in the recommended rpm range) either way. Early -detonation was an issue with lugging with 2 strokes...4 strokes are not the same in that area. Running too large of props does still put more pressure on the bottom end on both 2 or 4 strokes - crank, bearings, ect. which creates heat and addition wear and tear. It’s like running a car in 5 gear when it should be in 4th.