Crusader 350 Repower - 1976 23 Seacraft SF Inboard
 

Hey all,

Looks like I have a bad thrust plate in my 1996 350 Crusader, and I am considering selling the good running engine this fall to repower this winter/spring.

After talking with my shop, the two recommended engines are Mercruiser 383 (350 HP) FWC MPI or a Mercruiser 357 (310 HP) FWC MPI engine. I have Marine Powers in the Luhrs, and I like the crusader in my boat so I am open to other options. I've looked at the Crusader 5.7 and 6.0s too, also look like a decent option.

I think I have ruled out diesel. For what it would cost to go diesel I don't see a benefit. Would love to put a Yanmar 4 cylinder in it but at $39,500 for just the engine I could repower with gas 2-3 times all said and done.

I am looking to hear from you other inboard enthusiasts out there running a straight inboard. Cruising numbers, max speed, any thoughts/comments/opinions are appreciated!

Also, I may have a 1996 350 Crusader FWC EFI (Throttle Body) for sale if anyone is interested. Hours estimated to be 650 hours, based on previous owner and how much I have used it this year.

So far, leaning towards the Mercruiser 357. Factory three year warranty with the option to extend another two years through Mercruiser. 5 years on an inboard is pretty enticing.

The 357 has a fresh water flush down port which I like as well (similar to an outboard). Smartcraft and Garmin interface easy capabilities, and around 310 HP.

The 383 is slightly more expensive, and needs factory option FWC installed by the dealer. Warranty can only go up to 3 years vs. the 5 with the Horizon.

I just repowered my 78’ with a Crusader Captians Choice 5.7 and couldn’t be happier. That being said I went with the crusader for 2 reasons - 1. they are a great engine 2. Because that is what my mechanic recommended, prefers to work on and is comfortable with. He has a lot of experience with them and likes them better than the other engines out there. I figure if he has to work on it that it should be what he knows the most about. It has the flush port, which is a nice feature and he added a remote oil filter in front of the console near where the batteries are, makes it much easier to change the oil.
Performance is great, although I am looking at dropping the pitch from 16 to 15. Fuel consumption is easily 30% better than I had with my old carbed merc. Cruises 33-3400 rpm 23-24 knots. Top end over 34 knots. It all comes down to what you feel the most comfortable with.

After having owned both Mercruiser and Crusader inboards I would choose the Crusader.

IMO Crusader's marinized accessories are more rugged and better designed than the mercruiser parts. You have a 22 year old Crusader sitting in your boat right now that seems to be running fine. I think that is pretty good anecdotal proof of the durability / design of the Crusaders.

Thanks for the responses guys, I think it's between the Merc 357 and the Crusader 350 at this point.

To your point kevmen, my shop heavily prefers Mercruiser and does more Merc repowers than Crusaders. The price difference is very close, Mercruiser slightly more but with up to 3 years more warranty than the crusader.

The bad news, turns out the Crusader isn't doing to good. Low compression in two cylinders so it looks like I will be repowering this winter.

Talked to Mercruiser today, new engines you can get up to an 8 year extended warranty and the remans you can only get up to 3. This would be there new 6.2 300 HP or 350 HP models.

The reman 357 Horizon comes with the 3 year factory direct warranty so you don't have to shuck out any more, but you can't extend any further.

Crusader has a standard two year factory backed warranty.

The more I keep digging into this I think Crusader may be my choice this winter. The Crusader does have the capability to hook up to Garmin interface, guess its just not as plug and play.

I found the new 6.2L 300ho Merc for $11,300 plus installation, plus cost of extended warranty from 5 to 8 years. Mercury will not give you a quote on the warranty beyond 5 years without your submitting the serial number of the motor to them.

Know up front that the Passport extended warranty is actually (legally) an insurance policy, with deductibles, sold and backed by Brunswick. If you purchase it through your installing dealer, that's good.
If you purchase it after installation directly From Mercury, many dealers will try to tell you something is not covered, when in fact it can be. This is because they make considerably less money doing repairs under these warranties.
I bought an extended 1 year warranty for my 2011 90 Etec, purchased this past June. The dealer is a friend of mine, and recommended this particular warranty/insurance policy.

My dealer's normal retail labor rate is $115 per hour.
This particular insurance company pays him only $63 per hour for labor done under this warranty, and I have a $100 per-incident labor deductible.
And for work done under the original Evinrude extended warranty offered with new motors, the reimbursement rate is only $51 per hour.

This is why many dealers will try to tell you a particular repair is not covered under warranty. They get more than $50 hr more for retail than for warranty work.

And that highlights well why is important to have a good relationship with anyone who works on your boat or motor.

Thanks for the response Frank, sent you a PM too.

That sounds like a pretty good deal to me, I'll look into the new Mercs.

Whichever one you go with don't forget to upgrade to an aluminum oil pan.

Repower update, still debating on which way to go and I've decided to throw Marine Power into the mix.

Looking on their site, a new 350 FWC MPI engine is just under 10k on their website. We also put two new Marine Power engines in our 30' Luhrs 3 years ago, and we have had 450 trouble free hours so far.

If MP is in the mix you should take a hard look at the Direct Injection 5.3 or the 6.0.
5.3 is a Gen 5 small block, alum block and heads. Very light (~150-200# less than a 350) and extremely fuel efficient. GM is using them in the 1500 series trucks. 355HP and a great rep but just now used in marine applications.
6.0 is a Gen 4 small block (LS series); Iron block and aluminum heads. ~100# less than a 350 and much more efficient. GM uses them in the 2500 series trucks. PCM also sells them and they have a reputation for being almost bulletproof in both boats and trucks.
Both are FWC and have variable valve timing. Both have aluminum pans. The cylinder deactivation BS is NOT used on the marine versions of either one (thats good).

Biggest issues with the 6.0 would be the mounts, and space available under the console right now. The 5.7s are straight drop ins, very limited mods if any needed to drop a new one in.

The 6.0 would also be the most expensive option, and I found that the connecting the Crusaders to my Gamins and installing instrumentation would actually be more than going with Merc and a Smartcraft gauge. Couldn't believe that at first, but makes sense after seeing how plug and play all the Merc stuff is.

The mounts are the same for my I/O - not sure about IB. I have the room for the 1" wider and longer but have to get creative on height since I raised the outdrive 2" for an overall engine height increase of 3" - size might be the biggest problem for you. Livorsi and Maretron make NMEA to MEFI interfaces for the data. Others may as well. That said, I'm still doing fiberglass and have not bought/installed a motor yet. :eek: I'm leaning towards the MP 6.2 DI since I have a drive that can handle it and all my CAD stuff shows it fitting after my mods...

Have a chance to grab 2 2000s 350 Marine Powers MPI and FWC for short money. Engines are an estimated 1999-2000 model, hours need to be verified. Manifolds, risers, and valve jobs done to both. They were take outs in a twin application (both LH) that the shop took in trade on a pair of new engines after owner swtiched his mind.

Anyone have some performance numbers/comments/concerns with a similar year Marine Power 350?

Also I have confirmed, the Merc 357 will NOT fit under the console without modifying the front seat (at least in my boat).

Current options are these two used Marine Powers or just going with a new 5.7 Crusader.

Just ball park numbers, what does short money mean for the engines you've found? Thinking towards the future, I'll likely be repowering as well. Thanks

TDL, they are up for sale on Craigs now:

https://boston.craigslist.org/sob/bp...719436038.html

Well, final decision made. Ordered a brand new Crusader 5.7 MPI with a new ZF Hurth 630A 1.5:1. Let the repower games begin!

Engine should be here soon, will post some pics once we get it in the shop. Repower scheduled for first/second week of January.

Congrats on making the decision! Good luck with the repower! I couldn’t be happier with mine. Keep us posted.

Thanks Kev, engine is due at shop after New Years now as of this week. Once it's in the shop and it starts getting installed I'll have some good pictures to share.

And thanks again for letting me take a look at your setup too. Putting an in transom live well is on my wish list for the future after seeing your setup.

Engine is in!

Looks nice!
Now you need to add a few more letters on that Scrabble board; s, t, a, l, l, e, d
Just in time for spring.

Can’t wait to watch the progress! Good Luck! Send plenty of pics!

Absolutely will do. Just went over some things with the shop today and they'll be starting the install this week.

First dry fit to have the spacers measured and ordered.

Forgot to take some pictures but the engine/drivetrain is all in. Only current issue is console clearance and making the exhaust fit.

There were concerns for exhaust flow with the current muffler, so it was taken out and two dual long pipe exhaust baffles are being installed with custom brackets through dual exhaust ports - should have a nice rumble to it now and nice throaty sound when underway.

4 inch extensions were put on the risers, since the water line was pretty close to the level of the risers from factory. With the risers, we are having clearance issues with the console and shelf so more customizing is needed. Possible the whole console will have to be raised but that's a last resort.

Next time I am at it I'll snag some pictures of the install.

For anyone considering, Scalisi Marine in Weymouth, MA has done an exceptional job with this tough install and I highly recommend to anyone looking to repower one of these classic hulls.

Engine just did not want to fit, console had to be raised 4", the engine was moved back about 3", the risers were about sea level so we decided to put 4" extensions on the risers (of course they don't make 3" anymore), and the oil filter located off to the side in the engine bed. New shaft, cutlass, dripless stuffing box all are installed. We are almost there, just need to install the exhaust and get the harness/Garmins hooked up and talking to the Crusader. Then we can finally sea trial and play with some props.

I was able to snap a few pictures today of the install:

Wow - that is a lot of shoehorning. Amazing, actually.
What is the shop charging just for the install? Ballpark?

Estimate for engine/tranny/shaft/dripless/cutlass (essentially entire drivetrain) was around 20k.

Glad to see things moving along - FWIW I did try a new prop on my setup - went down to a 16x15 from a 16x16 - lost a couple knots at cruise, but the engine liked it much better - just ran smoother all around. Slightly slower getting out of the hole, but liking the change I made.

Good to know Kev, thank you!

I'm glad to see it moving too, shop is picking up with launching and spring service on other boats in the yard but I should be in the water in a few weeks doing sea trials.

Latest update, boat is in the water at the shop. Mechanics are trying to work out a communication issue between the Crusader and the Garmins, but once that's done I'll have some numbers for everyone.

The engine is TIGHT in the compartment, but the guys figured out a way to do it. I'll be finishing up the cosmetics of the console and tidying up the wiring myself.

Pictures a few days before it got launched:

Shop plugged their computer in to get numbers and sea trial boat, everything went perfect. We are going with a 15 X 14 LH prop, spins 5250 RPMs at WOT and goes about 34 knots. Cruising should be mid/high 20s.

Only outstanding issue is the Garmin screens talking to the Crusader. We have the Maetron block, and right now only the RPM needle will work for about 10 seconds then goes away. Can't get any other information to pop up on screen.

We've been waiting for Crusader to call the shop back all week to help diagnos and fix the problem. Anyone ever see this issue?

Boats back at the shop for the 25 hour break in.

Fuel consumption is around 2.0 nm/gal at cruise doing 4000 rpms - 20-22 knots pending sea conditions, better than I thought itd be.

Garmin connection got worked out, I have rpms, knots, temp, oil pressure, fuel consumtion and fuel flow, and engine hours.

The shop nailed the exhaust, two long pipe mufflers about 4 ft long to dual exhaust out the back has an awesome sound at lower rpms, not obnoxius at higher rpms. Good balance between wanting that nice sound but not sounding like a drag boat.

John,

Glad to hear you are up and running. I must be way over propped with my 16 x 17.
cruise @ 23kts @ 3400 rpm. Have any pictures of the dual muffler setup? I would pull a few spark plugs and inspect closely for any signs of reversion if you have not already done so just to be sure. The exhaust on these inboard run close the static waterline.

I don't have any pictures of the install under the deck. I can try and take some pictures this weekend and get a picture of the dual exhaust out the back.

Once we got the engine in the boat, we looked at the riser height in comparison to the water line. We played it safe, 4" extensions were added to the risers. Unfortunately this did not help with the console fitting issues, but well worth the piece of mind.

I've been bad with remembering the pictures, but my friend snapped this picture tonight.

More pics of install!

In my best Elmer Fudd voice.

Wooo oh woo

Looking good! Nothing like all new and a quality installation. still running the 15 x 14 prop?

Steve