Used Outboards
 

Been doing some research on used outboards for my 23 refurb. Found this posted on another boating site. Don't have any brand loyalty. Would appreciate your comments. Thanks

Yamaha HPDI-------1999-2001ish--------disaster
Yamaha 4 Stroke---------2002-2007ish--------great but exhaust corrosion on some engines(not all), Balancer issues on inline motors(not all), oil seal issues............not all had this Im not running away from these motors.
Yamaha 250 4stroke 2006-2007---------------1st run of variable camshaft.............Major Lower Unit Problems(Suprised Nobody mentions this) Notice how 2008 models and up have an extra colling intake on lower unit??????
Yamaha 250-300hp HPDI----------------ABSOLUTE DISASTER. Almost on par with Evinrude FICHT. I have seen so many people come through our shop with these motors blown.
Honda 4 Strokes------------Just not enough of them around to really know but to be honest................I have not heard any consistant bad things. I would own one but Lack of used parts may scare me.
Evinrude Ficht (first generation ETEC........yes I said that)-------------disaster
Suzuki 4strokes 2000-2007ish-------------great engines but corrosion..............typical Japanese
Nissan TLDI------------not enough of those around to know for sure............some have blown up
Mercury Verado Gen 1------------had issues---Lower Unit failures, Supercharger Failures, etc
Mercury optimax 1998-2000------Disaster............Opti BOMB
Mercury Optimax 2002-2005-------------Much Better
Mercury Optimax From 2006 to today------------Awesome
Mercury Verado Gen 2 (2008ish and up)-----------Awesome. People seem very happy with them.
Etec------------------Fine but this was basically a second gen Ficht( have fun with that one guys)
Yamaha HPDI made in last 5 years or so---------------Fine
Yamaha 4 Strokes Made within the last 7 years or so------------------fine I have not heard much about the corrsion.(time will tell I guess)
Suzukis made within last 5 years...................excellent.

Moral of the story.........................Motors that were made at around 1998-2002 (DFI) were basically the guinney pigs. That was an "experimental" time with all this new techonogly.

my 2 cent

International Marine had FLIBS pricing for twin Suzi 200's at $23,700 plus controls, 6 yr warranty. If I were in the market I would look hard at this one.

This guy was pretty broad on his statements. Suzuki only had corrosion issues on first gen 140s due to a metal casting plug in the engine holder but they sold a lot of them so it left a stinky mark in their reputation.

Second and third gen F350s were and still are until the 425s are proven one Yamaha’s best ever motors. The flywheel issue is now a maintenance procedure that Yamaha handles free of charge. Most dealers will send a tech to your house to complete in 20 minutes per motor. This is the last year of production for them and the remaining are selling as fast as dealers can get them in.

It’s sad to see the opti’s going. Other than being a little noisy the second gen was as reliable as the sun rising in the morning and they were super affordable. If I was looking for an affordable motor for a build I’d be looking hard at a used 250 Opti if a used 250 Zuke or Yamaha 4 stroke wasn’t in my price range.

300 APs can still be gotten for $18k rigged. Hard to beat with more than ample hp for a 23.

OK - so what recommendation would you have for a 20' MA getting a bracket? I would love to go new but have almost 175K in medical debt now from my heart attack I need to buy one as cheap as possible. (yes, that is the real number the hospital wants from just 33 hr stay)

There are weak points on every motor. Educating yourself on these common issues will help you to know what to look for when shopping. In my experience there are a few absolutes.

1. ALL MOTORS have weak points.
2. Most people don't sell motors that are running perfectly.
3. Buying used engines is ALWAYS a crap shoot.
4. You can test for somethings (compression, spark, codes, hours), but one of the best tests is a 20 - 30 minute ride through the full RPM range which is not always possible.
5. internal corrosion is not always easy to detect.
6. Fuel restrictions causes a LOT of 2 strokes to pop and that's not the fault of a motor as much as their owners would like to think. Common causes for fuel restrictions are USCG saftey nipples, screens in fuel pickup, filters, and crappy hoses. It doesn't take long to kill a 2 stroke from a fuel restriction.


2.6L Hpdi's (150,175,200) were very reliable. I am not aware or any major issues with the early years.

3.0L Opti's (225, 250) compressors go bad after a while. A local tow BoatUS captain up here carry spares optimax compressors and can change them on the water.

2002 - 2004 Fichts were good especially the 250's. After bombardier bought them they worked out a lot of the problems. There were issues with electronics in computer that can be addressed by DFI. Most ETEC's are fairly reliable.

Do not buy a used outboard unless u know where its coming from! If its to good too be true...it IS

there are plenty of used 150-200 mercury optimax around as everyone wants a four stroke instead of a lighter, more powerful, better fuel mileage dfi two stroke. If you are getting new, the 150 merc 4 stroke is a no brainer. with a bracket, you need to consider weight.

If you dont care about mileage, the merc efi is a good choice also.

yes, hospitals are crazy. I negotiated 50% off on a similar bill for a similar amount of time for a client of mine. But you have to be able to pay. They will sell that debt to a factoring company or other debt collector for pennies on the dollar

manitunc - are the opti's as quiet as the etecs? I am leaning towards getting one of those since they are light, efficient, and quiet :)

As far as the hospital bills go, trying to negotiate they are being a pain in the you know what. We have been asking for a detailed bill and the only thing we have gotten is the summary with the crazy bottom line. We tried to negotiate before I even signed out but, of course, the person I needed to talk with was not available...

The older Opti's are WAY louder than an etec.
However, the newer Opti's are pretty close to etec sound levels.

I have an etec on my 23 Sceptre, and working for a boatyard, have run many boats with older optis (one of them being a 25 Seacraft!).
I kind of like the sound of the older optis. They're loud, but kind of a unique sound. And the power is amazing. Torque for days.
That's why you always see the older optis on the Towboat US boats. ;)

We only take care of a smattering of the newer optis, but they seem pretty well built. Powerband is definitely not quite the same as the older ones though.

You have much better boat us service than we.

Sorry . . . I meant spare compressors for his own boat, not for customers motors. The guy runs twin 225 opti's on his Boston Whaler.

Couldn't just leave that there haha.

Comment on buying used outboards - you can get perfectly good used and save a lot of money if you do your homework like anything else.

1. Check the seller properly for any bad reviews, bad reputation and any BBB complaints.
2. Ask the right questions
3. Get what you need in writing - a reputable seller with nothing to hide will be pleased to provide what you request.

I've bought two separate 200 hp outboards at roughly 1/2 cost new and turned out perfect.

Large boat dealers often have fine used that get swapped out as owners want new or bigger motors.

Nice job you did listing the problematic motors, seems right on target.

Gents: Would like your input on the following. I ran across a pair of 2004 Optimax 135's counter rotating, well cared for with low hours. Owner wanted more power and 4 strokes. Would like your input on what to expect for the noise level and fuel burn. These would be going on my 23 WA. Thanks again.

Well Casey if these were EFIs I would tell you not to worry about the fuel burn, shoot it's only money and the Government can just add more taxes to help you pay for the fuel!! :) However the Optis are much better on fuel burn and that might be a really nice combo especially with the lighter weight issue of the two strokes. Not sure what the price is but low hours sure makes it a sweet deal. Again my '03 225 EFI treated me very well except at the gas pump!! Good luck!

Noisy.
Pretty good on fuel burn.
More torque than you'll know what to do with!
Boat will be fast, especially out of the hole.
:D

Don: the combined weight will be more that a big single. But as Capt LLoyd told me-taking the +300 lbs of steel shot out of the stringers will more than compensate for the extra weight. Talk about a royal PITA getting that s..t out.

I'm a parish priest of a very small congregation, and I, too, went looking for the best I could find in a smaller motor for my '88 18' Seacraft. I ended up getting a 2010 Etec 90 with under 200 hours for just $3K.

My (then) teen-aged daughter had gynecological surgery that her Dr's office assured us had been pre-authorized by the insurance company. They had, in fact only submitted the paperwork for authorization, and had not received a reply before the surgery took place. The insurance company rejected the claim after the surgery saying it was "not medically necessary".

We went through the appeals process and it was still rejected. Both the surgeon and anesthesiologist waived their bills, and the radiologist agreed to take just the copay as payment.

The hospital sent us a bill for over $80K. After the failed negotiations with the insurance company, we went to negotiate with the hospital, and they ended up accepting $1400 as full payment, which was slightly more than they would have gotten from the insurance company if the claim had been approved originally.

Being somewhat tenacious, I then submitted the receipt for my payment to the hospital to my insurance company for reimbursement, along with a copy of the Dr.'s original documentation saying the surgery was medically necessary. I was reimbursed for 80% of the $1400. All in all, the negotiations took almost a year.

Thanks for the encouragement. Believe it or not, so far we have gotten the 175K down to about 10K through the same type of persistence - my wife really wants me to be able to start enjoying my boat & life in general more (especially now), so she has been after the Dr's about the bills :)

Still going to be looking for a used outboard once I get the transom finished though since now it looks like I might be in for a total knee replacement as well

Ok Gents - bear with me, another question on my outboard search. What if any will I notice using a counter rotating engine as a single? Boat pulls to the left instead of the right? Are props easily sourced?

You probably will never notice much difference. Props are easily sourced.

I ran a left hand lower (counter rotation) outboard for a while and found out left hand props that were for sale without a match or not part of a pair were extremely cheaper than right hand ones. Not as many for sale used but the ones I found I got a deal on due to it not having a match.