Real world #'s on a 20' CC with a 140 4S Suzuki?

[Skink]

Hey guys, I know a few of you have a 20' Seacraft CC with a 140 4S, Zuke. I'm looking at that motor, and the Etec. What #'s are you getting? Did you raise the deck? Any water coming in the scuppers? I'm planning on raising the deck 1.5" in mine.

Thanks!

[SOS]

20' SF on a non flotation bracket, Suz 140 4s. I raised my deck 2.5 inches and it's self bailing with lite loads/fuel. If I fish four grown men and a full tank or just have a full load in the back of the boat I still get some water on deck.

I am replacing the scuppers from flappers to TH Marine ping pong balls to cut down on the flow.

Performance wise, I've seen 42mph lite, lite, lite once! Most times I am between 36-39mph with a normal or heavy load. My 40 gals of gas lasts forever!!

If I was going to re-power I would go 175 and would also like a flotation bracket. Can't have too much power and at rest the flotation would be nice.

All that said, only once did I truly need more power when I was caught with a heavy load, four guys, lots of fish/ice and terrible weather that came out of nowhere. We were safe but I should would have liked to have more power when climbing the back of a beast.

SOS

[Skink]

GREAT info SOS, thanks.

My only concern with the 175 is the extra 70lbs.

I haven't thought about a bracket, hmmm.

I was thinking about only raising the deck 1.5" sounds like I need to increase that.

Where do your scuppers drain? Out the back or the sides?

Thanks!

[Bushwacker]

Excellent question and the same one I had about 5 years ago! I put together a spreadsheet comparing all the motors in that size class which I can send you if you PM me with an e-mail address.

I considered the Zuke 140 because it's the lightest of the 4 strokes but ended up going with the 150 E-TEC (actually 165 hp @ prop) because of it's same weight with more displacement and mid-range torque and the much lower maintenance cost. Did not consider the 150 Yam, Honda or 150/175 Zuke because if you compare wet weight and include the cowling, they're almost 500 lb motors, which is WAY TOO MUCH for a boat designed for motors of about 300 lbs! Have made several long trips with very heavy loads (approx 3900 lbs total) and I'm glad I went with the stronger motor. Have had zero problems with it in over 330 hrs/5 years and it's only been to the dealer once for the 3 year service, although I do change the gear oil annually. I can cruise at 30 kts at a little over 4000 rpm and at that speed it's quieter than all the 4 strokes because it doesn't have to be wound up as much. Although I have seen 49.5 mph (GPS) with full fuel but a light load and the top down with a 14 1/8"x20" 4B SS Michigan prop, max speed is not a big deal for me. Easy low speed planing to handle rough conditions with heavy loads is my main priority. I normally run a 15x15 4B SS PowerTech prop which has an awesome hole shot that pops the boat on plane easily with max load at about 40% throttle (Throttle Position sensor reading on I-Command gage. Full throttle will nearly throw you out of the boat with a light load!) Max speed with this prop is about 39 mph with max load and both the Bimini and sun tops up. Optimum cruise per I-Command gage (fuel flow from ECM, GPS spedo) is about 37-3800 rpm at 27-28 mph at about 4 mpg with a heavy load and about 5 mpg with a light load and the higher pitch prop. The E-TECs run very lean below 2000 rpm, so mileage at hull speed (~5 mph) is around 10 mpg. Took a 700 mile trip last spring carrying a very heavy load, often cruising at higher than optimum speed and averaged 4.35 mpg for entire trip. On local trips with less load and cruising at optimum speed I typically average a bit over 5 mpg overall. I seem to use 1 gal of XD-100 full synthetic oil @ $35/gal for about 150 gallons of gas, so I only have to buy oil once or twice a year. Still not sure I have the optimum prop and I may be able to raise the motor a little more, but these are the performance numbers I'm currently getting.

Min planing speed, which is the most noticeable problem on these boats when running a heavy motor, is about 12 kts, which is the same as it was with the old 300 lb motor on the transom, but it was about 18 kts before I went to a 4B prop! You'll definitely need a good stern lifting 4B prop to do that!

With the Hermco bracket, static waterline is about 1" higher than it was with a 300 lb V-4 on the transom; boat is still self bailing at the dock, but I normally run with the plugs in or use the vortex check valve plugs if diving. Boat is original '72 configuration. Potter raised the deck 1-2" in the Seafari's about 73-74, but don't know about the CC's, as they don't have much gunnel height to start with and raising the deck makes that worse. (The recessed "cup" where the scuppers live is about 1" deep; it's 2-3" deep on the later models with raised deck.) However the Seafari is also better balanced than the cc to begin with (less stern heavy), so a cc would probably sit a little lower in the stern.

[SOS]

GREAT info SOS, thanks.

My only concern with the 175 is the extra 70lbs.

I haven't thought about a bracket, hmmm.

I was thinking about only raising the deck 1.5" sounds like I need to increase that.

Where do your scuppers drain? Out the back or the sides?

Thanks!

An etec would not be a bad option, I like four strokes but the etecs are solid by all accounts and 165HP at the prop sure sounds nice. I hear the Suzy 140 is really around 130, I have no facts to substantiate that but rumor says...

My scuppers drain out the back, I have three, one center and two sides. I'd raise the deck more, but as pointed out there is a balance with the low freeboard already.

I like the closed transom and bracket personally. I love these boats!!

Good luck!
SOS

[uncleboo]

[QUOTE]

I hear the Suzy 140 is really around 130,

That sucks! I was thinking about that the other day and was going to try and find out what the hp was at the prop! I was kinda getting excited to find out how much 'more' hp I had.

[Skink]

Great replies guys, thanks so much!

I see the Etec is more power, less moving parts and lighter. Unfortunately my wallet would be lighter by about $1,500 if I go with that. Have to check out the warranties on the two, it may be worthwhile spending the extra $. The numbers you are posting are VERY impressive, I think the etec may be worth the extra $.

If I were to run the scuppers out the transom, I would have to go through the livewell, and dry storage. Does anyone see an issue with them going out either side?



I really appreciate the feedback so far guys.

[Mark]

1971 20'
140 Suzuki
75 gallon fuel tank
deck raised 2.5"
WOT with full tank of fuel 41-42mph

in gallery - "Mark's 1971 20"

[Bushwacker]

I see the Etec is more power, less moving parts and lighter. Unfortunately my wallet would be lighter by about $1,500 if I go with that.

Take a careful look at maintenance costs on the 4 stroke, because you could easily spend that $1500 "savings" on the required 4S maintenance in the first couple of years! Ship Shape TV recently did a comparison between the E-TEC and Zuke maintenance requirements. In the first 3 years where you spend ZERO on the E-TEC, the dealer quoted well over $2000 in maintenance costs for the 4-stroke! They also looked at Yamaha, which had similar or even higher costs. I'd be asking how much of that maintenance you could do yourself without voiding the warranty!

Speaking of warranties, when the E-TECs first came out, they had a 7 year warranty, the first 3 of which were with BRP, and the last 4 with a 3rd party outfit. I understand the current extended warranties are now direct with BRP. They have a great reputation for handling warranty claims, so I would consider that an improvement over the 3rd party deal, although I've had no personal experience with either one.

[KenB]

Take a careful look at maintenance costs on the 4 stroke, because you could easily spend that $1500 "savings" on the required 4S maintenance in the first couple of years! Ship Shape TV recently did a comparison between the E-TEC and Zuke maintenance requirements. In the first 3 years where you spend ZERO on the E-TEC, the dealer quoted well over $2000 in maintenance costs for the 4-stroke! They also looked at Yamaha, which had similar or even higher costs. I'd be asking how much of that maintenance you could do yourself without voiding the warranty!

Speaking of warranties, when the E-TECs first came out, they had a 7 year warranty, the first 3 of which were with BRP, and the last 4 with a 3rd party outfit. I understand the current extended warranties are now direct with BRP. They have a great reputation for handling warranty claims, so I would consider that an improvement over the 3rd party deal, although I've had no personal experience with either one.

When etech first came out they had huge issues with cold temps and sticky oil. More than a few blew up. They had a great reputation for honoring warranties compared to OMC, but not too many 4s are known to blow up with catastrophic block failures the way etechs or HPDIs did.

I am going to have to call shenanigans on this... the suzi, yami, and honda maintenance costs are no where near what this guy is posting. He has been all over the site throwing up sort of silly numbers about ETEC versus japanese 4 strokes... makes me wonder if he is on the payroll or something.

Go look at the miami show. Go look at what is hanging off of 90% of the legit boat brands that are not owned by engine manufacturers... all yami. And the guys who repower tend to do suzi's for good reason.

The bottom line is that you can't go wrong with a 4s or a ficht I mean etec... they are all great engines. Anyone who claims any one of these new engines is way better than any other is any either on the payroll or... go check your local dealer network, buy the cheapest best thing you can. I personally would do a TLDI/Opti over an etech/HPDI based on what happens if you kink your fuel lines, and I would do a DF140 over anything except maybe a TLDI 115.

DF140 is a proven motor, even with all of the plastic parts inside. I guess my point is that a new engine, 4s, high pressure or low pressure 2s, porsche turbo charged, whatever, they are all great. DF140 is just a wee bit better than the rest and has the record to prove it.